Why am I such an angry Atheist?
This is what religion means for the overwhelming majority who believe in it, and here is why it is so uniquely capable of causing harm:
Religion is the belief in invisible beings, inaudible voices, intangable entities, undetectable forces, and events and judgements that happen after we die. It therefore has no reality check. And it is therefore uniquely armored against criticism, against questioning, and against self-correction. It’s uniquely armored against anything that might stop it from spinning off into extreme absurdity, extreme denial of reality, and extreme grotesque immorality.
This belief in an unverifiable, supernatural entity; the thing that uniquely defines religion, that makes religion what it is, that is exactly what cranks up it’s capacity to do harm to an alarmingly high level, because there’s no reality check.
In any other ideology or philosophy about the world, it’s evenually expected to pony up. It’s evenually expected to prove itself true, or correct itself and modify it and make itself more true, or fall by the wayside. With religion, that is emphatically NOT the case. Because religion is a belief in the invisible and the unknowable it’s therefore never expected to prove that it’s right, and it’s never even expected to show good evidence for why it’s right, this capacity to do harm can spin into the stratosphere.
I want to make a comparison here to show my point. I want to compare religious belief with political ideology. After all, religion is not the only belief that’s armored against criticism, it’s not the only belief that leads people to ignore evidence in favor of their their settled opinion. That’s a human trait, we all do that. And very contrary to the popular atheist saying, religion is NOT the only belief that inspires good people to do evil things. Political ideology can do that very nicely as well.
People committed horrors to perpetuate Soviet Communism, which was a political ideology that these people sincerely believed was best, and the horrors that were committed by Americans in the last Bush administration in the name of the values of democracy and freedom. But even the most stubborn political ideology will eventually crumble in the face of it not working. People can only be told for so long that under communism everyone will eat strawberries and cream, and in the unrestricted free market the rising tide will lift all boats. A political ideology makes promises about this life and this world, and if the strawberries and cream and the rising boats are not forthcoming, eventually people notice. The 2008 election was good evidence of that as is the current Occupy Wall Street movement. People can and will rationalize a political ideology for a very long time but ultimately the proof is in the pudding.
RELIGION IS DIFFERENT.
With religion, the proof is emphatically NOT in the pudding. With religion, the proof comes from these invisible beings, these inaudible voices. The proof comes from prophets and religious leaders who supposedly hear these inaudible voices and are happy to tell the rest of us what they’re saying. It comes from these religious texts that were written thousands of years ago, again, written by ancient religious leaders who supposedly heard these voices. It comes from the feelings in people’s hearts, you know, like I just feel god in my heart conveniently telling me what I already believe or what I want to believe, and the proof comes in the afterlife; AFTER people are dead and gone and can’t come back to tell us about it.
So again, with religion, even if the rules and promises that are supposedly made by god just aren’t working out, like if they’re clearly not happening, the followers will still follow them because the ultimate judge and judgment are invisible. There is no pudding, there is no proof, there is no expectation that there be any. In fact in many religions, the idea that you should expect proof is blasphemy. So therefore, there’s no reality check when religion starts to go to really bad places.
It drives me nuts when people insist that religious wars, religious bigotry, religious violence, and religious hatred and so on…it drives me up a tree when religious people say that’s not religion’s fault. No! Of course not! It’s the fault of religious leaders, you know, power hungry selfish greedy religious leaders who manipulate the people. Or it’s the fault of the people…it’s the fault of the religious followers..they’re driven by fear, ego, and tribalism, you know, they just don’t understand the true meaning of god….or else the wars, the violence, the hatred, they’re really about something else, it’s really about land or it’s about money or power…
Ok, of course the wars and violence and hatred are complex. Of course they’re committed by humans, of course they have a lot of causes feeding into them. But to deny the role that religion plays in religious conflicts? It’s a textbook example of ignoring the elephant in the room. I mean, it’s like looking at an enormous steaming pile of shit, of elephant shit in the room, and saying, “My goodness, where could all of this elephant shit have come from?. It must have been brought here by a greedy, selfish, power hungry elephant trainer! I don’t see any elephant here, and it’s bigotted and intolerant of you to suggest that an elephant caused that pile of elephant shit. How dare you!”
So when people say it’s not fair to blame religion for the terrible things that’s done in it’s name, I must passionately beg to differ.
And when you look at this littany of religious harms, if you look at them closely you’ll find that every single one of them has at it’s core this unique nature of religion, the thing that makes religion different from every other human activity; it’s fundamental unverifiability, and it’s fundamental lack of reality check.
So I think it is entirely fair to blame religion for the terrible things that’s done in it’s name. What makes religion unique is what makes religion FUCKED UP! And I think that Atheist anger is COMPLETELY JUSTIFIED. But is it useful? Does anger about religion help or hurt our cause? Well, I think if used carefully, it is not only helpful in this climate of social change, but necessary. Why? Because anger is always necessary. Because anger has driven every movement of social change that I am aware of. Anger has driven the labor movement, the civil rights movement, the gay rights movement, the environmental movement….every single one of these movements has had as a tremendous driving force, and tremendous amount of anger. Anger about injustice, anger about mistreatment and brutality, anger about helplessness.
We need to be very clear about this. Anger is not violence. Anger is not bigotry. Anger is not hatred. I’m not in favor of any of those things, but that’s not what anger is. Anger is emotion indicating displeasure and antagonism with a state of affairs. Anger is one of the ways that we know that things are not ok. And anger is what motivates us to do something about it. so when people tell Atheists not to be so angry about religion, they are basically telling us to disempower ourselves. They’re telling us to lay down one of the single most powerful tools we have at our disposal. They’re telling us to lay down the tool that as far as I know, no social change movement has been able to do without. They’re telling us to be polite and diplomatic, and don’t get me wrong, we need to be polite in diplomacy, but diplomacy is much more effective when coupled with passionate anger. And it’s working.
Right now, in all 50 states, the fastest growing religious affiliation is NONE. Rates of religious non-belief are rising at a very rapid rate. Clearly, we are doing something right. Clearly our anger (among other things) has been very effective. And clearly this has a lot of religious people freaked the fuck out. But what they don’t understand is that most of our anger is NOT about the harm that’s being done to Atheists, most of our anger is about the harm that’s being done to believers and the fear mongering and indoctrination of innocent children of religious parents. Atheists are not angry because we’re selfish, we’re not angry because we’re whiney, we’re not angry because we “have no joy or meaning in our lives”. We’re not angry because we have a god-shaped hole in our hearts….Atheists are angry because we have compassion. We’re angry because we have a sense of justice. We’re angry because we see harm being done, horrible harm to people in the name of religion, and our hearts go out to them. Atheists are angry because we want to see this stop. Atheists are not angry because there’s something wrong with us. Atheists are angry because there’s something right with us.
“The supremest task is to organize and unite people so that their anger becomes a transforming force.” – Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.
“I have learned through bitter experience that the one supreme lesson to conserve my anger. And as heat conserved is transmitted into energy, even so are anger controlled can be transformed into power that can move the world.” – Ghandi
These leaders who I’ve just quoted, today are held up as icons of peaceful, diplomatic, love thy neighbor activism. These leaders at the time they were leading, were NOT held up as icons of peaceful, diplomatic, love thy neighbor activism. Leaders who were, at the time they were leading, were seen as dangerous, radical threats to the stability of society, and who ONLY today held up as these paragons of sweetness and good manners. Who only today are being shoved in the faces of Atheist activists and activists of all kinds who are seen as being too confrontational and too intemperate, and too angry.
So the next time somebody asks you, “why are you Atheists so angry?” remember that. Don’t just remember the gay kids who are taught that they’re going to burn in hell, don’t just remember the women who are beaten by their husbands and the preachers who tell them to just suck it up. Don’t just remember the people cheated and stolen from by religious frauds, don’t just remember the kids who are being raped by catholic priests and the catholic church that’s covering it up. Remember the words of King and Gandi. Remember that anger can become a transforming force. Remember that anger controlled can be transformed into a power that can move the world.
And remember the people who are trivializing your anger, however concerned, however well-meaning, are trying to take that power away. Well I won’t let them.
It drives me nuts when people insist that religious wars, religious bigotry, religious violence, and religious hatred and so on…it drives me up a tree when religious people say that’s not religion’s fault. No! Of course not! It’s the fault of religious leaders, you know, power hungry selfish greedy religious leaders who manipulate the people. Or it’s the fault of the people…it’s the fault of the religious followers..they’re driven by fear, ego, and tribalism, you know, they just don’t understand the true meaning of god….or else the wars, the violence, the hatred, they’re really about something else, it’s really about land or it’s about money or power…
Please give me examples of secular athiest societies, and how they have also committed atrocities.
I would ask this to help you see that the real causes of war and persecution is fallen humanity. Humans, both athiest and relgious are prone to do awful things. This has been proven throughout history. If those involved in these attrocities were not in a religous context, chance are there would have been another reason for them to commit attrocities.
Christianity recognizes this. We do not claim to have a moral superiority, only the fact that man kind, all of us, have a tendancy to do stupid and sinful things.
Thanks for your post.
You have just missed the point. And you have just done this:
But to deny the role that religion plays in religious conflicts? It’s a textbook example of ignoring the elephant in the room. I mean, it’s like looking at an enormous steaming pile of shit, of elephant shit in the room, and saying, “My goodness, where could all of this elephant shit have come from?. It must have been brought here by a greedy, selfish, power hungry elephant trainer! I don’t see any elephant here, and it’s bigotted and intolerant of you to suggest that an elephant caused that pile of elephant shit. How dare you!”
Yes indeed it comes from the elephant. Exactly my point! Not the elephant’s beliefs, not the the way he sings his songs, not his friends, not his likes and dislikes. It comes from the elephant becuase it is in the elephant’s nature to dump a huge pile when he needs to. A lot like human beings!
I do not disagree that humans have used religion to sugar coat thier huge piles of poop, but huge piles of poop will happen with our without religion. And they have.
How about we look at the facts.
Here are some links for this.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Black_Book_of_Communism
Number of people killed by Atheists, espousing communism=94 million
(many were, and are, killed for thier religious belief, meaning that they were killed for not adhering to Atheism, others will killed for the sake of genetic cleansing, while still others, a large number will killed for political reasons)
please if you can find a better link, please give it to me. I could not find anything good (ie. academically supported) on the subject of Christianity.
http://markhumphrys.com/christianity.killings.html
The number I have here is 1,651,000
This did not inlcude slavery, as the author admits this was more of a political motive than a religious motive, especially when you look at the fact that the abolistionists were driven by Christianity.
Also the first statement in this is not historically accurage. When Christianity became Legal, the Emperor constantine remained Pegan, and the Empre remained Pegan, for the entirety of his life. Persecution of Pegan’s was never sanctioned during this time.
I would probably, easily, add another ten million. I would immagine those killed during the inquisition was a great deal higher, as records were not kept.
Hmmm? The point here is that humanity is prone to violence, and religion is just an excuse, as we can see by these numbers people, whether they are religious or not get mad and kill, so is politics, so are social disagreements, so is race. We are prone to anger no matter who we are.
Under, your logic, I should hate those who supprt communism. In fact you should hate them to. I dont think this is true. I have friends who are members of communist parties, I still love them.
Am I so hatefull, so ignorant?
Please note that you left off one of Dr. Martin Luther King Jr’s titles. You forgot that he is the Reverend Dr. Martin Luther king Jr. He was a Christian minister, that was his job. He continued in this role, preaching on Sundays for most of his life.
You still don’t get the point, and non-believing people who have done terrible things have not done them due to a god-shaped void in their heart, or that their atheist doctrine (don’t think one even exists!) commands it. They were not following some inaudible voice, and they don’t beat faggots to death because their non-god said they were to be put to death (you know, like the god of the bible says so).
Yes, people do fucking terrible things no matter what they believe or don’t believe, and they are just bad fucking people. I’m not talking about that. I’m talking about wars and hatred and violence caused as a direct result of WHAT THEIR RELIGION TEACHES THEM, which had it not taught it, it would never have happened.
But you just keep evading that, and doing the “I know you are but what am I” typical christian denial and evasive tactic, trivializing the role religion plays in the horrible things that have happened throughout human history, completely missing the point. And you have still completely ignored the elephant in the room. Bad people can and do exist with or without religion. That is NOT what this post is about, but with religion, good people can justify their bad fucking deeds. Why? Because as I stated in my post, there is no reality check.
And please, I know who Dr. King was. Sheesh!
If you want to start a movement against “People in general who do bad things” then by all means, do so. But I can guarantee, that if religion never existed, there would have been MILLIONS of people who didn’t die by it’s hand. Millions of atrocities then never would have happened. The world would be just that much less dangerous. Am I saying religion is the cause of all atrocities? Fuck no. I am addressing the SUBSTANTIAL AMOUNT OF THE HORRORS AND ATROCITIES THAT WOULD STOP HAPPENING IF PEOPLE WOULD WAKE UP AND CAST AWAY THEIR SADISTIC INVISIBLE IMAGINARY FRIEND IN THE SKY.
When that happens, maybe I’ll move on to the general category of bad people. But for now, I’ll stick with the current cause. Guaranteed if Muslim never existed radical muslim would never have existed, and 911 would never have happened. If the bible was laughed away as it should be in modern times, there would be a lot less dead gay kids. Without religion, where would have been a lot fewer divinely approved wars, suicide bombings, and hatred. Guaranteed 100%. And if you can deny that without justifying it with bringing up other bad things that happen (which I’m sure your deluded mind will), then I can no longer give you any status. Because arguing with a creationist is like a reproductive scientist arguing with a stork theorist. Loose the invisible man and inaudible voices and ancient texts from people who claim to have heard those inaudible voices. It’s irrational, ridiculous, and unreasonable in these times to believe such childish fantasies.
I cannot argue from the point of a religious person. That would assume I can speak for all religions I cannot. I can only speak from the point of view of a Christian.
What is a Christian. I believe that most do not understand this. A Christian is one who has accepted Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savoir. In doing so they have accepted the new covenant, that was sealed in his blood. (please note I am not writing this to offend you, but to tell you where I come from.) In several instances Jesus refers to what was taught by the Old Testament, by saying “You have heard it said, but I say…” He does this when he changes the command from “do not murder” to “do not even get angry.” Or when he changes the command “love your neighbour” to “love even your enemies.” Or when he changes the OT allowance for divorce, to don’t go down that path. There is a difference between Old and New Testament. The old points to the need for the New (Read the book of Romans for a better explanation on this).
A Christian is to understand that they are at their core, corrupt and sinful (that is why I keep making this argument). We are not allowed to judge because of this.
A Christian is then to confess those sins to God, being humble, in admitting that we are screw ups.
Then we are to ask for forgiveness, realizing that God paid the price for our sins so we would not have to.
Then we try hard to stop sinning. Knowing that we probably will. (Read Romans 7 for this).
Our final task is that in “Loving our neighbours” we are to teach other’s about Jesus. Being gentle and “being all things to all people”. As the apostle Paul called. We are to tell people about Jesus, because we love them enough to want them to know the truth. (We mean no offense.)
I would invite you to study the New Testament and find where it commands people to kill. Let me know when you find this!
Adolf Hitler told people publically that he was a Christian. He did this to gain support of the people. When we read his “table talks” we find that it was all a lie. People do awful things in the name of Jesus. People who have no idea what that means. Look at the murderers during the Crusades (while some were justified in what they did) they were people who had never read the Bible (most were not allowed) many had never set foot in a church (as the church was so corrupt at the time that many churches, especially those in south France, never actually opened their doors, because their priests were only priests as family favours and for political gain.) Many of these folks called themselves Christians but knew nothing about being a Christian.
Fred Phelps claims to be a Christian, but has acted in a way that even the most conservative of Churches cannot tolerate, as being Christian. Which is why the southern Baptist’s have put out a statement denouncing him (as he claims to be a Batiste.) http://www.sbc.net/aboutus/faqs.asp#20
The Murders of Matthew Sheppard, who many claim were Christians, were drunks, not Christians, though I am not sure if they claimed to be, I would assume they did.
That being said, Christians have indeed done awful things. But Christians are never commanded by God to commit atrocities. Our doctrines and scriptures do not in any way support this kind of behaviour. But we do it. We do it because we are wretched people, desperately in need of forgiveness.
I will admit that Christians have done really bad things. I guess that is the point of our savoir!
I will also admit that without religion there would actually not be fewer, there would be no divinely inspired atrocities. Would it be better to have politically, racially, or personally motivated?
I am not sure at what point I was disrespectful to you. But I will probably not continue this conversation after this point, although I would like to. You have shown that you are not open to real conversation. If you were you would not have assumed that my mind is “deluded”.
I do not deny that religious people do bad things in the name of their religion. I believe that other religions are untrue (while I would fight for their right to exist), I cannot answer for them. But I can say that Jesus Christ, at no point, in his scriptures (which is all we have to teach us) tells us that we should kill, go to war, hate, murder, be arrogant, or commit atrocities. This is what your post is about, if I am not mistaken. That you want to know why religious people do horrible things because the y are told to by their religion. I am saying that Christians, (while they may use Christianity ignorantly to support their ignorance and hate) are never taught by scriptures (our only source of teaching) to commit atrocities.
Jesus never existed, and christianity was created by men. Tell me, if you stop “just believing” and actually seek truth, you would research OUTSIDE of the bible. But you don’t, because you believe the bible, and the bible tells you to NOT THINK ON YOUR OWN, and for very good reason.
Isn’t it strange that during the time Jesus was allegedly doing his ministries and fantastic miracles, there were contemporary writers and philosophers who would have heard of this amazing man Jesus, as it says many times in the NT, that “word spread quickly”. Yet, there is not one single solitary writing about Jesus until the gospels 40 to 70 years AFTER Jesus’ supposed death. I would think that this man would certainly be something to write about. Yet in all the writings by known philosophers and writers of Jesus’ time on earth, not a single mention of Jesus. Not ONE! Jesus never appeared in written word until nearly 1/2 century AFTER his supposed ressurrection (which would also be something the contemporary writers sure would have written about). But NO, nothing, not a word. Not until the gospels were written. It is an obvious creation of a religion by men.
Do you know how many “gods” 1000′s of years BEFORE Jesus were:
– Born of a virgin on Dec 25th, performed miracles, was killed and rose from the dead 3 days later.
– Was welcomed by “three wise men from the east”
– walked on water
– healed the sick, gave sight to the blind…
At least 10 others fully documented gods BEFORE Jesus time. The creators of christianity just continued the copycat story for their god. It’s ridiculous.
Jesus never even existed, except in the minds of his creators named Matthew, Mark, Luke, Paul, John, George, and Ringo….oops, that’s the beatles…
I mean, c’mon. Seek the truth. Don’t work to keep bullshit alive.
Very good post and a lot of great supporting info in the comments! Good job!~